Obama

[a.baker]

Is Barack Obama a Muslim? I read he went to a Catholic school but yet he is a Muslim. He swore on the Koran but not on the bible. He won't put his hand on his heart and say the Pledge of Allegiance. Is this true? Muslims have stated before that they are going to get on the inside of America to ruin us. Is this their way? :(

[InTheWind]

There once was a Russia prez that lives here now that once said, I don`t want a annihilated United States what good would that do me, no i`ll win it from the indside out. :(

[CoreIssue]

He belongs to a church that is, in my opinion, racially motivated. So not a Muslim but sure not a gleaming example of Christianity, as are any of the candidates.

What a mess.

[Baggs6]

Here is a linke to Obama's church.


http://www.tucc.org/home.htm

[a.baker]

I am afraid to vote for anyone. I do not like this election at all. Who ever will be our next president I am afraid of the decision they are going to make with the war. I am afraid of outcomes.

[Jessie]

seems they are all off...

[InTheWind]

Pray for the rapture, things just keep getting weirder, I heard there were some UFO sightings in Texas anyone else heard that?
I think there will be an increase in UFO sightings the closer we get to the rapture, part of the deception imo.

[Jessie]

ITW I do I do pray for the rapture, I ask when will you send Jesus back to get us?
we are weak like you said we would be, and its getting so bad out there and no way to get away from it, and I dont like feeling like I live in a sewer spiritually daily.

[a.baker]

:nod: :pray: I agree.

[kay-gee]

But in the meantime, Hillary may increase your standard of life of being an American citizen. It's not all about war.

all the best...

[a.baker]

They just all say what you want to hear. Once they get there than they do what they want to do. It's politics, you just can't trust them. It would take one great president to fix the mess our country is in and I don't see that president any where.

[CoreIssue]

But in the meantime, Hillary may increase your standard of life of being an American citizen. It's not all about war.

all the best...
Yea. The Communist is going to make it all better by deciding everything for us stupid citizens.

[InTheWind]

Ya know Kay-gee it`s just your type of everything is fine attitude that allows these anti everything people to get elected. :(
Some times ya have to wake up and smell the roses and realize they`er not all what they appear to be.

[kay-gee]

I don't pretend that everything is going to be a bowl of cherries with Hillary at the helm. In fact I know there will be some things. You can't throw the baby out with the bath water so to speak. American citizens deserve some higher living standards don't you think. Lord knows you pay enough taxes. How about a little social responsibility, Like some semblance of health care for instance. shouldn't you guys expect more than an army and the wall of China surrounding you for your money. I am a very pragmatic man, and I say don't fear the future, Prepare for it!!!
There's a very real possibility that it is coming your way...
Ladies and Gentlemen........Madame President....

all the best...

[CoreIssue]

Hilary won't provide that.

We don't have good choices. But any of the main Repubilican ones are better. Edwards is the best of their lot, which is scary.

[kay-gee]

I'm predicting a Democrat president, whoever the candidate should be in the end. In fact I believe it is pretty inevitable at this point. Past US voting history would confirm this too.
all the best...

[InTheWind]

I'm predicting a Democrat president, whoever the candidate should be in the end. In fact I believe it is pretty inevitable at this point. Past US voting history would confirm this too.
all the best...

Well that would mean more gun bans and regulations so crime would go up.:(
Abortion and gay rights would be on the list of goody too shoe things to do. :(
They will disarm our military, pull out of the ME, try and sweet talk the terrorist into peace until we have another 911 or worse.:(
I don`t find anything appealing to a Dem. win. :ick:

[kay-gee]

Ungrounded fears many of them.

all the best...

[InTheWind]

Denial on your part, all those things happened on their watch.

[minitri97]

I'm predicting a Democrat president, whoever the candidate should be in the end. In fact I believe it is pretty inevitable at this point. Past US voting history would confirm this too.
all the best...

Well that would mean more gun bans and regulations so crime would go up.:(
Abortion and gay rights would be on the list of goody too shoe things to do. :(
They will disarm our military, pull out of the ME, try and sweet talk the terrorist into peace until we have another 911 or worse.:(
I don`t find anything appealing to a Dem. win. :ick:

So every country in the world has lower crime rates than us and more gun control....
Abortion is already legal...gays are people and deserve all the same rights.
We haven't been in a war to protect America since the Revolution...there wasn't a significant terrorist attack from the middle east before or after 9/11. CERTAINLY NOT EVER FROM IRAQ
We have had 20 years out of the last 28 with Republican presidents....I DON"T FIND anything appealing about that.

[CoreIssue]

I'm predicting a Democrat president, whoever the candidate should be in the end. In fact I believe it is pretty inevitable at this point. Past US voting history would confirm this too.
all the best...

Well that would mean more gun bans and regulations so crime would go up.:(
Abortion and gay rights would be on the list of goody too shoe things to do. :(
They will disarm our military, pull out of the ME, try and sweet talk the terrorist into peace until we have another 911 or worse.:(
I don`t find anything appealing to a Dem. win. :ick:

So every country in the world has lower crime rates than us and more gun control....
Abortion is already legal...gays are people and deserve all the same rights.
We haven't been in a war to protect America since the Revolution...there wasn't a significant terrorist attack from the middle east before or after 9/11. CERTAINLY NOT EVER FROM IRAQ
We have had 20 years out of the last 28 with Republican presidents....I DON"T FIND anything appealing about that.
Well, I suggest you study what is defined as crime in other countries and then re-examine who has higher crime rates.

Christians supporting abortion? Really?

Homosexuality is equal to heterosexual conduct? You think God sees it that way?

No terrorism before 9/11? What planet have you lived on?

As an Independent, the last President I have liked was Reagan. Yep, Replublican ones have been bad, but better than the Democratic alternative.

You really are not going to get much support of a site dominated by Biblical literalists.

[kay-gee]

addition, Having grown up in a social Utopia, I can honestly say: We have far less violent crime. This has not so much (if anything) to do with gun control (a relatively new thing). It has more to do with the nature of the people themselves. The people are much less trigger happy. Several reasons could be for this. I feel that the rugged climate plays a role. In a life style of struggle, folks tend to pull together. Of course there is crime, but it has not reached the epic porportions, percentage wise of USA. Abortion, right or wrong, as mini97 points out, is already legal and being practised in USA. Homosexual rights is coming, no doubt about it. That is due to the human condition, nothing to do with the person in the Oval Office. The second worst act of terrorism on American soil, was commited by one of your own home-grown good old boys. How soon we have forgotten about Timothy McVey. He was no Islamic patriot. Go figure! I feel for you guys. I know how it must feel, seeing that "Rome is burning" (figuratively) The golden era of America is over. The Asian rim powers are pulling the economic plug! The ice berg has been struck. It's Over! Liberty and Justice for all. It really could have meant something. Could have laid an example for the world to follow. Instead, just another failure on the heap of human history. In the end, we are all just human.

all the best...

[InTheWind]

I'm predicting a Democrat president, whoever the candidate should be in the end. In fact I believe it is pretty inevitable at this point. Past US voting history would confirm this too.
all the best...

Well that would mean more gun bans and regulations so crime would go up.:(
Abortion and gay rights would be on the list of goody too shoe things to do. :(
They will disarm our military, pull out of the ME, try and sweet talk the terrorist into peace until we have another 911 or worse.:(
I don`t find anything appealing to a Dem. win. :ick:

So every country in the world has lower crime rates than us and more gun control....
Abortion is already legal...gays are people and deserve all the same rights.
We haven't been in a war to protect America since the Revolution...there wasn't a significant terrorist attack from the middle east before or after 9/11. CERTAINLY NOT EVER FROM IRAQ
We have had 20 years out of the last 28 with Republican presidents....I DON"T FIND anything appealing about that.


Vote Dem. then and watch everything go down hill. They pass gun laws making criminals out of hunters and honest citizens and let criminals off with nothing.
Abortion should not be legal and gays should not have rights as married people. If you don`t think God is against gays life style re read your bible.
If you think we can sweet talk the terrorist into not killing us by letting them do what they want your sadly mistaken.

[CoreIssue]

KG, Canada has the extreme advantage of not having a border with anyone other than the US. In many areas the majority of crimes in the US are committed by illegals from Mexico.

No, not crime free without them but most assuredly our stats would drop tremendously if they were not here.

GAO Report (http://www.gao.gov/htext/d05646r.html)

So, don't sing the praises of Canada too loudly until you take into consideration all the facts.

Sure, the world is in moral decline. All of it. And in my view Canada is far farther down that road the US. But I am not bragging on the US as we are in the trash as well.

Like it or not, there is a direct relationship to racial makeup of an area and crime. Sure, not always 100% relationship but it is there. City Data (http://www.city-data.com/) is a good source.

[minitri97]

Well, I suggest you study what is defined as crime in other countries and then re-examine who has higher crime rates.

Christians supporting abortion? Really?

Homosexuality is equal to heterosexual conduct? You think God sees it that way?

No terrorism before 9/11? What planet have you lived on?

As an Independent, the last President I have liked was Reagan. Yep, Replublican ones have been bad, but better than the Democratic alternative.

You really are not going to get much support of a site dominated by Biblical literalists.

Just looking at murder. Using reports form the United Nations study on crime. I can not find another 1st world country that has a higher murder rate/100000 citizens than the United States. Most countries are between 0-2/100000 citizens. The USA is between 4.5 and 5.5. This data is about 8 years old...its probably gotten worse.

There is a difference between supporting abortions and realizing that politicians don't care about abortions. 3 Republician presidents have had 20 years to over turn Roe V. Wade (with control of congress at times as well) and yet after conning religious folks out of their vote....they did nothing.

In response to God and gays. Please don't make me bring up things in the bible that people...are allowed not to follow. Thou shalt not Kill...unless your President says its in the name of your country.

What other major terrorist attacks have there been outside of 9/11? (major means more dealths than normal violence in the USA). Admittedly OK City... but that was a citizen has was pointed out. Well and of course there has been abortion clinic bombings.

NOTHING about Reagan was good. His economic plan killed the middle working class. Trickle down economics, please. Take a look at our federal budget graph shown here. http://www.uuforum.org/deficit.htm
He ended the cold war? The Russians RAN OUT OF MONEY FIRST. Then Reagon orderd another massive military buildup, AFTER the cold war was over. A bad actor, worse president.

I'm not looking for support, just to inject a little logic to your discussions.

[InTheWind]

In response to God and gays. Please don't make me bring up things in the bible that people...are allowed not to follow. Thou shalt not Kill...unless your President says its in the name of your country.



False reply, we are to follow our elected gov. And shall not kill is talking about murder imo not self defense or fighting for your country whether you agree with the war or not.

[CoreIssue]

In response to God and gays. Please don't make me bring up things in the bible that people...are allowed not to follow. Thou shalt not Kill...unless your President says its in the name of your country.



False reply, we are to follow our elected gov. And shall not kill is talking about murder imo not self defense or fighting for your country whether you agree with the war or not.
Correct. The Hebrew word means murder.

In Mosaic Law self defense and national defense were not murder.

And most assuredly a dodge answer on gays.

[CoreIssue]

Just looking at murder. Using reports form the United Nations study on crime.

A dodge.

First, how the data is collected and what is defined as what varies country to country.

Second, many countries have much higher crimes labeled as non-violent.

I repeat, recheck what is called a crime in other countries and how data is collected. The US tends to keep much better records without tweaking the numbers.

And the United Nations? Oh, yea. A real friend of the US.

[minitri97]

Lol, ok, I absolutely BELIEVE the bible is hogwash...can you say you KNOW I am wrong? Ok, so you also BELIEVE you are right. As a GAY person, I pretty much welcome the "rapture"...give me a break. Whats next, ray guns and the time travel.

If you think that the USA is the most honest government in reporting crimes consider this...many other countries have police that do not even carry firearms.....yet they have less crime and a greater % of happy citizens.

your arguements are so based on belief and not logic it is astounding. REMEMBER we are talking about POLITICS not religion.

[a.baker]

O.k. back to the bible. When we look at what is considered a crime in Gods eyes not mans laws no country is better off than the other. Their all sick! So time to put the blame finger down on what country does what; according to God they are all in the same boat. It's black and white; no gray areas.

[InTheWind]

As a GAY person, I pretty much welcome the "rapture"...give me a break.


My view has always been hate the sin, love the sinner.
Being gay is correctable, I hope anyone that is gay can repent and change as with any sin.
Praying for ya. :nod:

[CoreIssue]

Lol, ok, I absolutely BELIEVE the bible is hogwash...can you say you KNOW I am wrong? Ok, so you also BELIEVE you are right. As a GAY person, I pretty much welcome the "rapture"...give me a break. Whats next, ray guns and the time travel.

If you think that the USA is the most honest government in reporting crimes consider this...many other countries have police that do not even carry firearms.....yet they have less crime and a greater % of happy citizens.

your arguements are so based on belief and not logic it is astounding. REMEMBER we are talking about POLITICS not religion.
Look at the Forum Title - - Politics and Religion ;)

We are quite willing to discuss if the Bible is hogwash or not. But take that discussion to the Open Debate Forum where it belongs. And yea, I can say I know you are wrong and we can discuss that as well in Open Debate.

Hmmm. Even England has police carrying guns now. But feel free to list all these nations that do not.

Is the US perfect? Not even close.

You want the US to become socialist? Your choice.

Is socialism succeeding in other nations? No. Try being 65 or older in England and get more expensive surgeries. Not going to happen. Or many advanced medical procedures at any age in England or Canada. Not available.

Australia did serious gun control and got a rise in crime in return. England is NOT a peaceful country. Countries who turned to legalized drugs and providing them to suppress crime got less crime but now have huge social and other problems and are being forced to back off free drugs.

As I said, it all depends on how you look at issues, what you do and how you record and report.

[kay-gee]

Absolute hogwash! my father died 2 years in April at the age of seventy nine from heart complications. It is estimated that he lived 20 years longer than he should have, considering he had his first heart attack in his fifties. This is due in large part to the quality of Canadian health care. My mom also being in her 70's recieves nothing but the utmost care available. In USA the elderly cant get the treatments needed simply because they can't afford them, and find themselves haggling with greedy insurance companies . Which system is better?

all the best...

[CoreIssue]

Absolute hogwash! my father died 2 years in April at the age of seventy nine from heart complications. It is estimated that he lived 20 years longer than he should have, considering he had his first heart attack in his fifties. This is due in large part to the quality of Canadian health care. My mom also being in her 70's recieves nothing but the utmost care available. In USA the elderly cant get the treatments needed simply because they can't afford them, and find themselves haggling with greedy insurance companies . Which system is better?

all the best...
Think what you want, KG. But the US medical centers, etc., near the border and making money off of Canadians every day.