Seventh Day Adventist

[a.baker]

I started researching this because someone at my mothers work is into this and it make her so upset that she wanted to cry. She says she doesn't know much about this Church so I thought I would make a new thread to maybe gain some info. so me and her can talk about it. I started to research on it and I started to get upset as well. So I am going to state what this Church believes as far as I know of in the next paragraph all in a quotation mark so no one gets confused that this is what I believe. I don't believe this doctrine and it angers me that others do. After I state that I will make a new reply of my opinions and/or questions.

What Seventh Day Adventist believe:

" God reveals His love By:

1. creating man and woman
2. Jesus death was for our hateful choices towards God and His way. Jesus death guarantees forgiveness in choosing Him and allows us to spend eternity with Him.
3. Hope

Seventh Day Adventist think that the 10 commandments are just something extra to add on to the first 3. They think that God loves us even when we choose to reject His love. They think that Jesus is God himself. Gods vision for one is life as He lives it. Hell doesn't exist. Hell is now, earth, where we are currently living. They also believe washing of feet as a ritual about 4 times per year. Men and women go into separate rooms to do this on each other. Their diet is vegetarian. The don't believe one should participate in watching sports, dancing, bowling, or even playing pool. The church was founded in 1863 with the extensive writings held high in their church still today by Ellen G. White. They believe this woman experienced over 2000 visions."

[a.baker]

O.k. #1 Jesus death was to pay for our sins so they may be forgiven. Gods love was by sending His Son. #2 its more than just believing in Jesus even though believing in Jesus is the most important thing, other things do follow with that as well. The bible has a section on repent or parish.These things follow because we believe. #3 um hope? o.k. but the bible, God, talks about faith, faith, faith. Hope is mentioned little compared to how often faith is mentioned. So this shows that faith is most important. Hope is hoping that He destroys all evil in the end which we know by faith that He will because He says so in His Word. #4 If we ever knowing reject His love we are in turn rejecting the Holy Spirit and God states that won't be forgiven. We can't be forgiven in rejecting Him once we have known Him. Thinking we will be forgiven once we reject Him is a lie from satan. If you ever truly knew God in the first place you would never by any means reject Him period! #5 Jesus is God?! Many times Jesus refers to God as God, not himself. He refers to himself as Gods Son. Jesus is the Lamb in revelations and God is God. It clearly states that have different roles. Not the same. #6 Gods vision for us is to look to Him and His Son for everything we come across with in life and living out His Word. God is much too great to live a life like us. That is why He dwells in heaven not earth. #7 They think hell doesn't exist?! Um they are in for a wake up call. #8 They listen to a woman teacher when the bible talks against it? They take everything she states in as fruit? She has had 2000 visions? What?!?! #9 Diet? o.k. maybe a little less extreme but there is nothing wrong with or goes against the Christian religion if you consume meat. The way God designed our bodies is to consume meat and vegetables and much more other food groups. #10 Why in the world do they think they must wash their feet? Didn't Jesus say we didn't have to do that any more since He has come? #11 The activities they don't join in on are beyond me. Anything can become unclean not just these certain activities.

So at any rate any more input or insight is needed.
:grr::scratch:

[CoreIssue]

7th Day Adventists are considered cult by many.

They believe in a so called prophetess, Ellen G White, from the late 1800s.

They believe in the Sanctuary Judgement, meaning none are ruled saved or damned, until this End Time vent.

The rewrite the meaing of the MK and a lot more.

And are legalists.

Not a healthy Christian group, if Christian, at all. Which is debated.

[a.baker]

I think they are in for a wake up call. What does MK stand for? They pick out certain stuff and really twist it don't they? They also disregard the rest. Are they considered our brothers and sisters in Christ? I would say not, but I don't want to condemn anyone or be quick to judge either. They believe in Jesus as the Messiah which would say they are our brothers, but they really twist it up which says they are blind and they don't hear or see and they don't know God or Jesus like they claim to. I am confused on what to call them. What would God think of this; any insight?

[kay-gee]

MK = Millenial Kingdom

all the best...

[Jessie]

they are legalistic.

many here are vegetarians. I say cultic. they put ellen white on the same level as the NT from what I've seen.

we are under grace not legalism like dont eat this or that dont do this or that like holidays.
they dont take the MOB as being literal but figurative.
scripture is clear its literal.

many here wont eat pork, meats but the other things Gods word says to defently abstain from they do. (which we are seeing clear across the board anymore)

foot washing?

with saying you cant do this and that...
thats manmade doctrine.

some people say you cant wear makeup, shave your legs, must wear dresses,
wemon not to cut hair and so on, thats all manmade. not scriptural at all.

why be under law when we are under grace? law is destructive. grace gives life.

[John Beckett]

`

From what I have been made to understand, they also believe that Michael the Archangel was Jesus Himself, which is why he was the only one powerful enough to defeat Satan in the Heavenlies and cast him down to Earth.

Absolutely incredible. :nope:

[CoreIssue]

`

From what I have been made to understand, they also believe that Michael the Archangel was Jesus Himself, which is why he was the only one powerful enough to defeat Satan in the Heavenlies and cast him down to Earth.

Absolutely incredible. :nope:
Shared thinking with the JWs.

This is a new one on me. Been a lot of years since I did a study on them.

[a.baker]

Are they our brothers and sisters in Christ?:scratch:

[CoreIssue]

Are they our brothers and sisters in Christ?:scratch:
Adding the Michael issue, absolutely not.

[kay-gee]

Be sure not to confuse legalism with sanctification. The bible does not explicitly say don't dress like a prostitute. But why would you want to if you are trying to exercise Christian virtue in your life. The same is for drinking and many other things. As for Michael the arch angel, I think that is an exclusive JW doctrine. I have never read it in any 7 day literature.

all the best...

[a.baker]

Thats what I was thinking... they are not. Their Church and what it follows upsets me but I am sure there are many like these out there. And you can't talk to these people either. They are quick to defensive anger and they won't listen. Thats where the if they want to hear let them hear comes in. So I would assume that this is a situation that the bible refers to with the AC spirit dwelling within and not the Holy Spirit (since they get angry when you start talking about Jesus in a Christian belief). Their doctrine says it right there with what they believe. I don't really want to know any details of what they believe either. :grr:

[CoreIssue]

Thats what I was thinking... they are not. Their Church and what it follows upsets me but I am sure there are many like these out there. And you can't talk to these people either. They are quick to defensive anger and they won't listen. Thats where the if they want to hear let them hear comes in. So I would assume that this is a situation that the bible refers to with the AC spirit dwelling within and not the Holy Spirit (since they get angry when you start talking about Jesus in a Christian belief). Their doctrine says it right there with what they believe. I don't really want to know any details of what they believe either. :grr:
Nope. Not exclusively JW.

Michael (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seventh-day_Adventist_theology#Identification_with_the_Arc hangel_Michael)

[John Beckett]

THIS, FROM WIKIPEDIA .....

Identification with the Archangel Michael

Seventh-day Adventists have traditionally identified Jesus Christ with the archangel Michael (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archangel_Michael) of Daniel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Daniel) chapter 12. This is arguably a consequence of Seventh-day Adventism's semi-Arian origins. However, some Protestant scholars fully supporting the Trinitarian concepts have also argued for the same identification. Given that Seventh-day Adventism is now expressly Trinitarian (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trinitarianism) (see previous discussion), it is questionable whether this identification can still be used as criticism of Adventist Christology (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christology).
The Adventist position has been summarised thus:
"We believe that the term 'Michael' is but one of the many titles applied to the Son of God, the second person of the Godhead. But such a view does not in any way conflict with our belief in His full deity and eternal pre-existence, nor does it in the least disparage His person and work." [25] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seventh-day_Adventist_doctrine#_note-21) Contrary to common perception, in forming this identification Adventists are not relegating Jesus to something less than divine (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Divinity) or God. The term "angel" is interpreted not as a specific class of sub-divine heavenly beings as in the standard Christian view, but more broadly as any being serving as a messenger from God. This interpretation follows from the derivation of the English word "angel", which originally came from the Greek ἄγγελος (ángelos) meaning "messenger". Hence Christ is understood to bring a message from God, but His full divinity is retained.

For a further Seventh-day Adventist perspective on this issue, see the essay: Who is Michael? (http://www.sdanet.org/atissue/trinity/michael.htm), by Henry Feyerabend.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seventh-day_Adventist_doctrine#Identification_with_the_Arc hangel_Michael

[John Beckett]

`

Wow. Intelligent minds think alike ... :D

Anyway, that is errie, isn't it??

I remember having a conversation with a SDA in Yahoo's Christian Chat,
back in 2000, and she was very intelligent and sincere in her beliefs
about the distinct possibility that Jesus and Michael may be one and
the same.

[Jessie]

Be sure not to confuse legalism with sanctification. The bible does not explicitly say don't dress like a prostitute. But why would you want to if you are trying to exercise Christian virtue in your life. The same is for drinking and many other things. As for Michael the arch angel, I think that is an exclusive JW doctrine. I have never read it in any 7 day literature.

all the best...

good point KG.

what happens with them its all about following rules. and
not a relationship. so many many rules.

[kay-gee]

Can't blame folks for trying to get it right. I have no fellowship with SDA but for different reasons. Like all the other organizations, I try to treat them with the due respect and not denegrade them too much. I find that you are as unlikely to persuade people that are rock solid in a particular teaching, as they are to persuade you. So why not live and let live, and everyone bring forth their best fruit, and on judgement day, the Lord will do the sorting! The jekyll and Hyde thread goes into some detail about this. So a.baker and every one, Lets be less about criticizing SDA and others, and more about getting our own ducks in a row!

all the best...

[CoreIssue]

Can't blame folks for trying to get it right.
Are they? Or are they looking for beliefs that make them comfortable?

In this day in age very few have the excuse they didn't have a chance to look at all the alternatives.

Being one who has dealt with cults, for decades, I have found most want the beliefs they have, didn't actually test it out to see if true or not.
I have no fellowship with SDA but for different reasons. Like all the other organizations, I try to treat them with the due respect and not denegrade them too much.
There is a difference between rejecting the theology and rejecting the person.

The person deserves some respect. The doctrine does not.
I find that you are as unlikely to persuade people that are rock solid in a particular teaching, as they are to persuade you.
Defeatist attitude. Feeling that way isn't going to enable you to get far with much of anyone.
So why not live and let live, and everyone bring forth their best fruit,
Because there is no good fruit in false doctrine.
and on judgement day, the Lord will do the sorting!
So, let those into false doctrine just burn. You are in the door, everyone else can worry about themselves?

Did Christ take on flesh with that attiude in mind?
The jekyll and Hyde thread goes into some detail about this.
Yep. And got soundly disputed.
So a.baker and every one, Lets be less about criticizing SDA and others, and more about getting our own ducks in a row!

all the best...
The welfare of others is part of our ducks.

Such eye closing and indifference doesn't fit anything Biblical about loving ones enemies, witnessing to others or such.

Very self centered attitude.

[John Beckett]

`

I agree, Core.

I am not suggesting that we go to every SAD's house and proselytize to them
in order to sway them away from their beliefs, and stuff. But to blatantly
ignore what we believe to be their false doctrines kind of falls in line with
throwing their souls to the wolves.

[Chrystalwuzhere]

Can't blame folks for trying to get it right. I have no fellowship with SDA but for different reasons. Like all the other organizations, I try to treat them with the due respect and not denegrade them too much. I find that you are as unlikely to persuade people that are rock solid in a particular teaching, as they are to persuade you. So why not live and let live, and everyone bring forth their best fruit, and on judgement day, the Lord will do the sorting! The jekyll and Hyde thread goes into some detail about this. So a.baker and every one, Lets be less about criticizing SDA and others, and more about getting our own ducks in a row!

all the best...

kay-gee... that's not scriptural. We are told in God's word to exhort and rebuke so that we may be sound in the faith. If we live and let live, then error would enter the church uncontested.

a.baker is showing great wisdom for someone so young. She is researching and studying. She is not willing to live and let live, and neither should we be either. We are told to stand against false doctrine. So, let a.baker learn and discuss in peace.

I'm banning you from this thread.

[a.baker]

I agree with what you said Core about giving the person respect and not the doctrine. Some people do just blindly start following beliefs without looking for any proof or studying them. I agree.:nod: And that is sad. But for those that want to hear let them hear. :D