Healing

[CoreIssue]

Divine healing AND the ability to use medicine and such to heal.

So, a gifted Christian doctor is indeed gifted.

Strong's Number: 2386 Browse Lexicon (http://bible.crosswalk.com/Lexicons/Greek/browse.cgi?number=2386&version=kjv) Original WordWord Origini[amafrom (2390 (http://bible.crosswalk.com/Lexicons/Greek/grk.cgi?number=2390&version=kjv))Transliterated WordTDNT (http://bible.crosswalk.com/Lexicons/Greek/grk.cgi?number=2386&version=kjv#Legend) EntryIama3:194,344Phonetic SpellingParts of Speechee'-am-ah http://bible.crosswalk.com/images/audio.gif (http://bible.crosswalk.com/cgi-bin/lexicon.pl?id=2386g) Noun Neuter Definition
a means of healing, remedy, medicine
a healing

[Jessie]

I agree Drs. have to have a gift to do what they do!

its not a easy or pleasent job.

[Neachley]

I believe that God can still heal us today, but that He sometimes doesn`t. Why? Well certainly not for any supposed lack of faith as the Word of Faith people would have it. No, I just think sometimes God has something else planned for us, and so healing through prayer isn`t then an option.

There are, as you say, many fine doctors who do heal and who themselves have faith.

[CoreIssue]

I believe that God can still heal us today, but that He sometimes doesn`t. Why? Well certainly not for any supposed lack of faith as the Word of Faith people would have it. No, I just think sometimes God has something else planned for us, and so healing through prayer isn`t then an option.

There are, as you say, many fine doctors who do heal and who themselves have faith.
Well said.

[Neachley]

Thank you! :)

[2scoops]

I believe one of the biggest gifts that God gives us towards healing is knowledge. I believe Jesus still heals today. I think docotrs today are not what they used to be. Medicine back then was a totaly different practice. Pharmacuetical companies these days are profit driven. Many pills today work becuase of a placebo effect, o no one is sure how effective it truly is. Then you have your exercise buffs, etc. I believe our society is driven by a lof of lies and we as Christians should seek God for TRUTH.

1 Timothy 4


1Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
2Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
3Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
4For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
5For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.
6If thou put the brethren in remembrance of these things, thou shalt be a good minister of Jesus Christ, nourished up in the words of faith and of good doctrine, whereunto thou hast attained.
7But refuse profane and old wives' fables, and exercise thyself rather unto godliness.
8For bodily exercise profiteth little: but godliness is profitable unto all things, having promise of the life that now is, and of that which is to come.
9This is a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptation.
10For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.
11These things command and teach.
12Let no man despise thy youth; but be thou an example of the believers, in word, in conversation, in charity, in spirit, in faith, in purity.
13Till I come, give attendance to reading, to exhortation, to doctrine.
14Neglect not the gift that is in thee, which was given thee by prophecy, with the laying on of the hands of the presbytery.
15Meditate upon these things; give thyself wholly to them; that thy profiting may appear to all. 16Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee.

[CoreIssue]

I agree in general.

But there are some doctors that really care and try. I know a couple. One in specific.

[2scoops]

I know but many doctors do not see us as a body and a spirit. A lot treat just the symptom. Our spiritual life affects our health, 8For bodily exercise profiteth little: but godliness is profitable unto all things, having promise of the life that now is, and of that which is to come. I believe a lot of our answers lie in the bible. We can be proactive and obedient to understanding our health better. Medine back then wasn't a pill, they didn't use chemicals to formulate medicine, they had to use what God created. God did say my people suffer for lack of knowledge.

[CoreIssue]

I know but many doctors do not see us as a body and a spirit. A lot treat just the symptom. Our spiritual life affects our health, 8For bodily exercise profiteth little: but godliness is profitable unto all things, having promise of the life that now is, and of that which is to come. I believe a lot of our answers lie in the bible. We can be proactive and obedient to understanding our health better. Medine back then wasn't a pill, they didn't use chemicals to formulate medicine, they had to use what God created. God did say my people suffer for lack of knowledge.
Agree. The spiritual component is being addressed by a lot of doctors. But, unfortunately, not Biblically, but metaphysically.

[eahaddix]

Then you have your exercise buffs, etc.

;) And? What about "exercise buffs"?

I am doing physical conditioning in preparation for martial arts training. Why? For self-defense, more physical energy and ability, and self-confidence, all of which contribute to my personal testimony for Christ Jesus.

Our spiritual life affects our health, 8For bodily exercise profiteth little: but godliness is profitable unto all things, having promise of the life that now is, and of that which is to come.

The KJV's rendering of 1 Timothy 4:8 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1%20Timothy%204:8;&version=50;) implies that Paul views physical exercise as a waste of time. However, the semantics of this rendering are misleading. Consider the following material:

1 Timothy 4:8 [NIV (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1%20Timothy%204:8;&version=31;)]
For physical training is of some value, but godliness has value for all things, holding promise for both the present life and the life to come.

1 Timothy 4:8 [Greek (http://www.studylight.org/isb/bible.cgi?query=1+Timothy+4%3A8&section=0&it=kjv&ot=bhs&nt=na&Enter=Perform+Search)]
h (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=3588) gar (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=1063) swmatikh (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=4984) gumnasia (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=1129) prov (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=4314) oligon (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=3641) estin (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=2076) (5748 (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/extras.cgi?number=5748)) wfelimov (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=4314), h (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=3588) de (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=1161) eusebeia (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=2150) prov (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=4314) panta (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=3956) wfelimov (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=4314) estin, (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=2076) (5748 (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/extras.cgi?number=5748)) epaggelian (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=1860) exousa (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=2192) (5723 (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/extras.cgi?number=5723)) zwhv (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=2222) thv (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=3588) nun (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=3568) kai (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=2532) thv (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=3588) melloushv. (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=3195) (5723 (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/extras.cgi?number=5723))

The Greek word for "little" is oligos (Strong's #3641), which means:

"little, small, few

of number: multitude, quantity, or size
of time: short
of degree or intensity: light, slight" [Stong's Lexicon (http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=3641)]"of uncertain affinity; puny (in extent, degree, number, duration or value); especially neuter (adverbially) somewhat:--+ almost, brief(-ly), few, (a) little, + long, a season, short, small, a while" [Strong's Greek Dictionary (http://www.sacrednamebible.com/kjvstrongs/STRGRK36.htm#S3641)]

Notice that oligos could refer to low numbers of benefits, low duration of benefit, low intensity of benefit, or low extent of benefit. These possible variants in meaning imply many different contexts, all of which do not dismiss physical training as useless. To the contrary, "few benefits" does not mean "no benefit," especially within the framework of the said comparison. As a result, one cannot view oligos as a negation of physical training itself, but rather a simple comparative mechanism between godliness and physical exercise.

In essence, 1 Timothy 4:8 advises proper prioritization between godliness and physical training. Godliness is universally useful, while physical training has limited, specific uses.

Now, let me pose a few questions. How does physical fitness in general not fit into our daily witness to others? If we suffer the negative effects of poor dieting, no exercise, and bad sleeping schedules combined, then how does our testimony not suffer as well? We will become moody, impatient, and mentally unfocused, no?

:ick: Sorry, but the John Hagee body type should not represent Biblical Christianity, regardless of how much people dislike physical exercise.

[CoreIssue]

Extremes are bad.

Christ did not have couch potato lifestyle. But neither did he go the the gym and pump iron for hours like some do.

Each person has a different body build dictated by genetics. It is a fact some people carry more weight than the weight charts recommend. Some less.

On on experiment, a few years ago, they selected several people, plus and minus in weight, and worked to put them right on the money.

Some lost weight and tested fine. Some lost weight and test malnutritioned with insufficient body fat.

Some gained and were fine. Others test excessive body fat.

So, take care when judging by appearances.

Also, John Hagee might not be Mr. Body Builder and is carrying a bit more weight than he should. But a Body Builder body is an excess in the opposite direction.

Moderation is the key. Not excesses in either direction.

[eahaddix]

Each person has a different body build dictated by genetics. It is a fact some people carry more weight than the weight charts recommend. Some less.

Agreed. Contrary to mainstream thinking, thin physiology is not the paramount sign of health or physical fitness. In fact, my wife rolls her eyes at this mentality.

However, at the same time, your point is not an excuse for lethargy. Man's physiology was not designed for our high-stress, busybody society of systematic automation. In light of this reality, reasonable physical exercise does benefit one's health, especially in relieving stress, countering processed foods, and increasing physical energy. Why should this reality offend you? :shrug:

So, take care when judging by appearances.

Where did I endorse judgment by appearance? I used John Hagee as an example because we know that he is a "pulpit potatoe."

Also, John Hagee might not be Mr. Body Builder and is carrying a bit more weight than he should. But a Body Builder body is an excess in the opposite direction.

Moderation is the key. Not excesses in either direction.

Agreed. But where did I endorse Bodybuilding?

For the record, I believe that Bodybuilding is a silly hobby. Bodybuilding involves puffy, non-functional muscle volume, which benefits nothing except personal ego.

[CoreIssue]

However, at the same time, your point is not an excuse for lethargy. Man's physiology was not designed for our high-stress, busybody society of "convenience." In light of this reality, reasonable physical exercise does benefit one's health. Why should this reality offend you? :shrug:
Where did I ever say otherwise?

But how does one define reasonble?

It does not offend me at all. Why should it?
Where did I endorse judgment by appearance? I used John Hagee as an example because we know that he is a "pulpit potatoe."
When you said his body type, it appeared an appearance judgment with that yuck face added.

Agreed. But where did I endorse Bodybuilding?

For the record, I believe that Bodybuilding is a silly hobby. Bodybuilding involves puffy, non-functional muscle volume, which benefits nothing except personal ego.

I guess it is in the definition. To me body building is more than sculpting. It is spending time on the weights pumping iron in excess.

You see people deliberately developing this or that part of the body for appearance, not function.

But, you also see strength developement in excess. Like competitive weight lifters. They sure are not sculpted by they sure have tons of body muscle developed for one purpose.

Many athlietes overdevelop their muscles, such as baseball and football players. Sure, it makes them stronger for the sport. But it also makes them actually more injury prone than less developed people.

So, I think we are looking at the full spectrum differently.

[Brandli5]

Does the bible say somewhere in there "We should eat to live, not live to eat??" Jesus was like this was he not?

[eahaddix]

But how does one define reasonble?

The answer depends upon numerous personal factors, such as raw physical needs, desired goals, and preferred activities or sports. However, you cannot receive any benefits of exercise without exercising.

Where did I ever say otherwise?


It does not offend me at all. Why should it?

These questions are good rhetorical questions. I will leave these questions as are.

When you said his body type, it appeared an appearance judgment with that yuck face added.

Correct. However, you are engaging in semantical gameplay. I used John Hagee as an example because we are familiar with his lifestyle. His physical appearance is a visual representation of his "pulpit potatoe" lifestyle.

You are extracting hasty generalizations from my words.

I guess it is in the definition. To me body building is more than sculpting. It is spending time on the weights pumping iron in excess.


You see people deliberately developing this or that part of the body for appearance, not function.


But, you also see strength developement in excess. Like competitive weight lifters. They sure are not sculpted by they sure have tons of body muscle developed for one purpose.


Many athlietes overdevelop their muscles, such as baseball and football players. Sure, it makes them stronger for the sport. But it also makes them actually more injury prone than less developed people.


So, I think we are looking at the full spectrum differently.

Careful. A sliding definition of "Bodybuilding" allows for biased semantical gameplay.

For instance, I could classify all Weight Training as "Bodybuilding." All Weight Training builds muscles, regardless of training habits. Hence, if "Bodybuilding" is an extreme, then Weight Training is an extreme as well. As a result, you could define "moderation" as "not doing Weight Training," which is a logical extreme.

Therefore, we should differentiate between slang definitions and recognized definitions. For instance, in terms of official sports, Bodybuilding is different from Weightlifting. The former focuses on maximizing visual aesthetics, while the latter focuses on maximizing functional capability. Both sports rely on maximizing Weight Training for different types of competitions, which entails the extremes that you speak of. However, any advanced Weight Training, in and of itself, is not an extreme.

[CoreIssue]

I am not understanding this discussion.

Exercise for health I get. Exercise that drastically alters body appearance from the human norm I do not get.

A soldier has an excellent physical condition. But they do not look altered.

A construction and such worker has excellent conditioning. But they do not look altered.

In my life I have been there. Did work where my muscles and body didn't have any where on it that was not rock hard. But I never looked 'different.'

So, I don't understand justifying non work and non normal activities that are designed to alter the shape of ones body or give muscle structures beyond the norm.

You mentioned physical defense.

Well, most into karate and such will tell you that too much muscle is not good. Slows you down.

Guess I don't get it and never will.

[eahaddix]

I am not understanding this discussion.

You view Weight Training as pointless, yet you refuse to openly say this. Instead, you construct subtle semantical arguments to condemn Weight Training without overtly condemning Weight Training. As a result, we engage in a semantical debate that appears pointless.

So, let us simply agree to disagree.

You mentioned physical defense.

Well, most into karate and such will tell you that too much muscle is not good. Slows you down.

;) Hmmm . . . Have you heard of Bolo Yeung (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bolo_Yeung) (ref. pics (http://www.completemartialarts.com/whoswho/pictures/boloyeungpic1.htm))?

[Jessie]

moderation is the key. and it is hard not to go to an extreme one way or the other.

with a lot of people they are using steroids to bulk up. most of this we see is NOT normal in apperence. and then they have other problems because of it.

a look of strength is not the same as having strength.

frankly I'm sick of hearing all over the place we need to eat this that and the other thing.
(I think most of it is for them to sell us something) otherwise we will get cancer or you name it. of course common sense is in order but I think its a bondage. fear of sickness,
having to look GREAT, just uses too much energy, that can be focused in more important things.

and nope I'm not saying be a couch potatoe, or a excersise guru,
enjoy what we do....not drive ourselves batty.

[a.baker]

I just exercise to relieve stress. Sometimes I do videos or go to the gym (love to read because i can at the same time I am on the treadmill) or I will just walk. I have the most enjoyment walking outside by myself super fast. A lot of times I will pray while I walk and get to be outside at the same time! Yes too many people look at working out as being superficial. I do it because I enjoy it and nothing else. It does feel good to be soar the next day after a good workout though. But for someone who doesn't exercise it can be a chore to get started. But once you start you will find it makes you feel good and happier. As far as eating I just eat whatever and stop right before I get stuffed. And I try to wait to eat until my stomach starts to talk. Sometimes we may think we are hungry but we may just need water. Too much of anything is bad for you... yes even water.